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	<title>Comments on: My First DMCA Takedown</title>
	<atom:link href="http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html/feed" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html</link>
	<description>Musings of a techie lawyer</description>
	<pubDate>Sun, 20 May 2012 19:21:08 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Jack Ass</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-621</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack Ass</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Mar 2007 19:43:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-621</guid>
		<description>Jack-dont you mean your name is Jack Ass? Hahahaha
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		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Jack-dont you mean your name is Jack Ass? Hahahaha</p>
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		<title>By: Jack Haas</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-620</link>
		<dc:creator>Jack Haas</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 25 Mar 2007 19:40:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-620</guid>
		<description>My name is Jack Haas, and I am Qwerty-you have something to say-email me at jackhaas70@yahoo.com-OK, I am one tough dude though.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>My name is Jack Haas, and I am Qwerty-you have something to say-email me at <a href="mailto:jackhaas70@yahoo.com">jackhaas70@yahoo.com</a>-OK, I am one tough dude though.</p>
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		<title>By: Qwerty Sucks the BIG ONE!</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-619</link>
		<dc:creator>Qwerty Sucks the BIG ONE!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 24 Mar 2007 18:12:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-619</guid>
		<description>qwerty,

What is a "bonified legal issue"?

Are you an attorney?

Hahahahah....Qwerty sucks the bog ONE!!!!!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>qwerty,</p>
<p>What is a &#8220;bonified legal issue&#8221;?</p>
<p>Are you an attorney?</p>
<p>Hahahahah&#8230;.Qwerty sucks the bog ONE!!!!!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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		<title>By: 2fs</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-618</link>
		<dc:creator>2fs</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Mar 2007 04:41:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-618</guid>
		<description>"space" way up there asks why no one's recognizing "the value of protecting intellectual property": but this essay - &lt;a href="http://levine.sscnet.ucla.edu/general/intellectual/against.htm" rel="nofollow"&gt;http://levine.sscnet.ucla.edu/general/intellectual/against.htm&lt;/a&gt; - suggests that creativity and the circulation of ideas generally are in fact enhanced by a more free exchange of ideas. Not to mention, of course, that the notion that one professor's use of 30 seconds of an NFL broadcast - even on YouTube - could possibly in any way diminish the value of NFL's proprietary rights over its broadcasts. What, the millions who watch football are instead going to watch only the "pirated" YouTube copyright notice and deprive the NFL of billions of dollars? If it's somehow legally necessary for the NFL to attack YouTube and Prof. Seltzer here, in order to retain its copyrights, something's seriously wrong with the copyright laws.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;space&#8221; way up there asks why no one&#8217;s recognizing &#8220;the value of protecting intellectual property&#8221;: but this essay - <a href="http://levine.sscnet.ucla.edu/general/intellectual/against.htm" rel="nofollow">http://levine.sscnet.ucla.edu/general/intellectual/against.htm</a> - suggests that creativity and the circulation of ideas generally are in fact enhanced by a more free exchange of ideas. Not to mention, of course, that the notion that one professor&#8217;s use of 30 seconds of an NFL broadcast - even on YouTube - could possibly in any way diminish the value of NFL&#8217;s proprietary rights over its broadcasts. What, the millions who watch football are instead going to watch only the &#8220;pirated&#8221; YouTube copyright notice and deprive the NFL of billions of dollars? If it&#8217;s somehow legally necessary for the NFL to attack YouTube and Prof. Seltzer here, in order to retain its copyrights, something&#8217;s seriously wrong with the copyright laws.</p>
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		<title>By: Hobb</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-617</link>
		<dc:creator>Hobb</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 21:03:02 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-617</guid>
		<description>...maybe qwerty's right and the current legal framework on copyright is stupid and repressive.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8230;maybe qwerty&#8217;s right and the current legal framework on copyright is stupid and repressive.</p>
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		<title>By: Qwerty-just-Got-Owned!</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-616</link>
		<dc:creator>Qwerty-just-Got-Owned!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 12 Mar 2007 19:14:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-616</guid>
		<description>&gt;&gt;&gt;&gt;If you are, how come you don't know how to spell "bona fide"?

Please do not attempt to provide legal advice unless you are licensed to practice law. &#60;&#60;&#60;&#60;

Now that was a MAJOR ownage!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>>>>>If you are, how come you don&#8217;t know how to spell &#8220;bona fide&#8221;?</p>
<p>Please do not attempt to provide legal advice unless you are licensed to practice law. &lt;&lt;&lt;&lt;</p>
<p>Now that was a MAJOR ownage!</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: qwerty-bad</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-615</link>
		<dc:creator>qwerty-bad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Feb 2007 20:04:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-615</guid>
		<description>qwerty,

What is a "bonified legal issue"?

Are you an attorney?

If you are, how come you don't know how to spell "bona fide"?

Please do not attempt to provide legal advice unless you are licensed to practice law.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>qwerty,</p>
<p>What is a &#8220;bonified legal issue&#8221;?</p>
<p>Are you an attorney?</p>
<p>If you are, how come you don&#8217;t know how to spell &#8220;bona fide&#8221;?</p>
<p>Please do not attempt to provide legal advice unless you are licensed to practice law.</p>
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		<title>By: Assman</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-614</link>
		<dc:creator>Assman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Feb 2007 12:27:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-614</guid>
		<description>qwerty just got pawned, or whatever it is the kids are saying these days.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>qwerty just got pawned, or whatever it is the kids are saying these days.</p>
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		<title>By: David Nieporent</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-613</link>
		<dc:creator>David Nieporent</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Feb 2007 07:07:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-613</guid>
		<description>In addition to Bill's quotes, I'd suggest Ty, Inc. v.  Publications International Ltd., 292 F.3d 512 (7th Cir. 2002).  Two relevant excerpts:

"(Notice that the purposes listed are illustrative rather than comprehensive.  Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music, Inc., supra, 510 U.S. at 577-78.) In deciding whether a particular use is fair, the "factors to be considered shall include"--and notice again that the listing is ILLUSTRATIVE RATHER THAN EXHAUSTIVE; Congress "intended that courts continue the common law tradition of fair use adjudication " and [section 107] "permits and requires courts to avoid rigid application of the copyright statute, when, on occasion, it would stifle the very creativity which that law is designed to foster," 

and

"The important point is simply that, as the Supreme Court made clear not only in Campbell but also in Sony Corp. v. Universal City Studios, supra, 464 U.S. at 448-49 n. 31, THE FOUR FACTORS ARE A CHECKLIST OF THINGS TO BE CONSIDERED RATHER THAN A FORMULA FOR DECISION; and likewise the list of statutory purposes. See also Castle Rock Entertainment, Inc. v. Carol Publishing Group, Inc., supra, 150 F.3d at 141; Ringgold v. Black Entertainment Televison, Inc., 126 F.3d 70, 78 and n. 9 (2d Cir. 1997). Because the factors and purposes are not exhaustive, Ty can get nowhere in defending the judgment by arguing that some or even all of them lean against the defense of fair use."</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>In addition to Bill&#8217;s quotes, I&#8217;d suggest Ty, Inc. v.  Publications International Ltd., 292 F.3d 512 (7th Cir. 2002).  Two relevant excerpts:</p>
<p>&#8220;(Notice that the purposes listed are illustrative rather than comprehensive.  Campbell v. Acuff-Rose Music, Inc., supra, 510 U.S. at 577-78.) In deciding whether a particular use is fair, the &#8220;factors to be considered shall include&#8221;&#8211;and notice again that the listing is ILLUSTRATIVE RATHER THAN EXHAUSTIVE; Congress &#8220;intended that courts continue the common law tradition of fair use adjudication &#8221; and [section 107] &#8220;permits and requires courts to avoid rigid application of the copyright statute, when, on occasion, it would stifle the very creativity which that law is designed to foster,&#8221; </p>
<p>and</p>
<p>&#8220;The important point is simply that, as the Supreme Court made clear not only in Campbell but also in Sony Corp. v. Universal City Studios, supra, 464 U.S. at 448-49 n. 31, THE FOUR FACTORS ARE A CHECKLIST OF THINGS TO BE CONSIDERED RATHER THAN A FORMULA FOR DECISION; and likewise the list of statutory purposes. See also Castle Rock Entertainment, Inc. v. Carol Publishing Group, Inc., supra, 150 F.3d at 141; Ringgold v. Black Entertainment Televison, Inc., 126 F.3d 70, 78 and n. 9 (2d Cir. 1997). Because the factors and purposes are not exhaustive, Ty can get nowhere in defending the judgment by arguing that some or even all of them lean against the defense of fair use.&#8221;</p>
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		<title>By: chris newman</title>
		<link>http://wendy.seltzer.org/blog/archives/2007/02/13/my_first_dmca_takedown.html#comment-612</link>
		<dc:creator>chris newman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 22 Feb 2007 06:40:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://wendy.seltzer.org/wordpress/?p=385#comment-612</guid>
		<description>I don't think the Teach Act is relevant here at all, because it provides a safe harbor in addition to fair use principles, not a limitation on their pre-existing scope.  But if there is authority saying otherwise I'd be grateful to see it.

qwerty:  Thanks for offering to look up some authority to help shed light on the discussion.  If I'm understanding you correctly, you're not disputing that Wendy wins on fair use factors 3 and 4.  Rather, you are asserting that she has failed to make any colorable showing that would satisfy factor 1, and that this failure is sufficient to place her actions outside of fair use.  This seems contrary to the notion of fair use as a balancing test--normally in such tests, you can lose on one factor but still win if the others cut your way.  Moreover, it would seem that at the very least you have to agree that the "character" of her use was non-commercial.  Why is  that not sufficient to satisfy the first factor given that there is no dispute that this use does not harm the market for the copyrighted work?

You also seem to be assuming that for use of an excerpt to be "educational" the reproduction must be accompanied by some commentary on the content of the excerpt itself.  Even assuming that this is so (and this is one of the things I'd like to see authority for), why isn't it satisfied by the blog post, which did comment on the overreaching nature of the copyright notice?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I don&#8217;t think the Teach Act is relevant here at all, because it provides a safe harbor in addition to fair use principles, not a limitation on their pre-existing scope.  But if there is authority saying otherwise I&#8217;d be grateful to see it.</p>
<p>qwerty:  Thanks for offering to look up some authority to help shed light on the discussion.  If I&#8217;m understanding you correctly, you&#8217;re not disputing that Wendy wins on fair use factors 3 and 4.  Rather, you are asserting that she has failed to make any colorable showing that would satisfy factor 1, and that this failure is sufficient to place her actions outside of fair use.  This seems contrary to the notion of fair use as a balancing test&#8211;normally in such tests, you can lose on one factor but still win if the others cut your way.  Moreover, it would seem that at the very least you have to agree that the &#8220;character&#8221; of her use was non-commercial.  Why is  that not sufficient to satisfy the first factor given that there is no dispute that this use does not harm the market for the copyrighted work?</p>
<p>You also seem to be assuming that for use of an excerpt to be &#8220;educational&#8221; the reproduction must be accompanied by some commentary on the content of the excerpt itself.  Even assuming that this is so (and this is one of the things I&#8217;d like to see authority for), why isn&#8217;t it satisfied by the blog post, which did comment on the overreaching nature of the copyright notice?</p>
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